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	<title>
	Comments on: All Aboard! GUARDIAN Transit Line	</title>
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	<link>https://boiseguardian.com/2008/01/16/all-aboard-guardian-transit-line/</link>
	<description>A different slant on the news.</description>
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		<title>
		By: dog		</title>
		<link>https://boiseguardian.com/2008/01/16/all-aboard-guardian-transit-line/#comment-7398</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[dog]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Jan 2008 21:05:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://boiseguardian.com/wp/?p=849#comment-7398</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[So what does happen if Micron tanks? How about HP closing Boise operations? Will we have a transit problem then? Simplot has a lot to gain by a well funded transit system. You can bet it will get low paid workers to and from low paying jobs. It will also open up tons of Simplot owned property for housing developments.

Will air pollution levels prevent us from getting federal money for transit? Assuming the Feds have any money.
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So what does happen if Micron tanks? How about HP closing Boise operations? Will we have a transit problem then? Simplot has a lot to gain by a well funded transit system. You can bet it will get low paid workers to and from low paying jobs. It will also open up tons of Simplot owned property for housing developments.</p>
<p>Will air pollution levels prevent us from getting federal money for transit? Assuming the Feds have any money.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Tom Ryder		</title>
		<link>https://boiseguardian.com/2008/01/16/all-aboard-guardian-transit-line/#comment-7397</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tom Ryder]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Jan 2008 13:40:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://boiseguardian.com/wp/?p=849#comment-7397</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Thanks to Curious Bob for citing &quot;Treaure Valley in Transit&quot;.  The complete study and conclusions with detailed explanations and assumptions can be found at the Valley Regional Transit web site...http://www.valleyregionaltransit.org/Portals/0/Studies/ROCIP/final_reportwithoutmaps.pdf.  It is one of those studies that we all seem to think lead no where, but in this case it does confirm that the answer to improving Treasure Valley transportation may require additional funding for public transit.  This study does include some consideration for rail especially corridor preservation, but primarily it focuses on the Guardians favorite method of moving people, buses, vans and other alternatives.

Sara is right on that it is time to stop the studies, quit analyzing and start taking real action.  Unfortunately, the limiting factor is neither hopes and dreams or even demand...but is instead funding.  The TV in Transit study identifies potential sources.  The Treasure Valley transit coalition did a study and it identified various sources and many very knowledgeable urban planners have identified various sources, but guess what...all legitimate sources involve taxes in some form.  Some one up above suggested a fund raising drive, the Guardian likes to believe that voluntary ride sharing is an answer and the tech people like to suggest home offices.  I support all of those as we all should.  But in the end, it does take lots and lots and lots of funding and those will fall short.  Should we try them, sure go ahead...let&#039;s educate, encourage and work together.  But let&#039;s be honest and admit that if we want to address the Treasure Valley transit congestion it will take massive amounts of funding from public sources and that means taxes.  Again, whether you want to support public transit or not, massive funding will be required to add lanes, rebuild interchanges, condemn right of way and otherwise maintain our current plans.

So, now we are left with question of who is going to pay these taxes?  My vote is for the feds and tourists.  I am also somewhat skeptical that will generate enough, so just as others who have published the studies (so many times) have concluded maybe the solution rests with US.  Maybe a local funding source should be identified and tapped to solve these local problems.  Maybe, as Pogo said, we have found the problem and it is US and maybe it is up to US to solve it...not the feds, not the state but the true beneficiaries of the good that will come of it.  So with that in mind, and as I have stated previously, our first step must be identifying a secure and long term source of funding.  My recommendation is we support the proposal that will be made to the Idaho legislature that would allow a local vote to fund transportation improvements...both roads/highways and transit.  The proposal would require a super majority and would have many sideboards and protections for taxpayers and voters.  The public vote would include a requirement that the plan for spending any funds be detailed and publicized completely.  The actual language of the legislative proposal is located at various places including &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.valleyregionaltransit.org/Portals/0/CoalitionForPT/DraftRTAlegislation.pdf.&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://www.valleyregionaltransit.org/Portals/0/CoalitionForPT/DraftRTAlegislation.pdf.&lt;/a&gt;

Oh, and in reply to Billy Idaho and Mr. Logic, do you really think it would be a wise career move for me to criticize Company execs?  As far as Simplot is concerned, I am very proud of some of our programs including subsidized van pooling, flexible work hours for avoiding traffic congestion, our sustainable Simplot award program which recognizes successful reductions in energy usage and many other corporate wide programs to address these issues. Are we doing enough...no...none of us are and now we all must do more...including paying more taxes.
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks to Curious Bob for citing &#8220;Treaure Valley in Transit&#8221;.  The complete study and conclusions with detailed explanations and assumptions can be found at the Valley Regional Transit web site&#8230;<a href="http://www.valleyregionaltransit.org/Portals/0/Studies/ROCIP/final_reportwithoutmaps.pdf" rel="nofollow ugc">http://www.valleyregionaltransit.org/Portals/0/Studies/ROCIP/final_reportwithoutmaps.pdf</a>.  It is one of those studies that we all seem to think lead no where, but in this case it does confirm that the answer to improving Treasure Valley transportation may require additional funding for public transit.  This study does include some consideration for rail especially corridor preservation, but primarily it focuses on the Guardians favorite method of moving people, buses, vans and other alternatives.</p>
<p>Sara is right on that it is time to stop the studies, quit analyzing and start taking real action.  Unfortunately, the limiting factor is neither hopes and dreams or even demand&#8230;but is instead funding.  The TV in Transit study identifies potential sources.  The Treasure Valley transit coalition did a study and it identified various sources and many very knowledgeable urban planners have identified various sources, but guess what&#8230;all legitimate sources involve taxes in some form.  Some one up above suggested a fund raising drive, the Guardian likes to believe that voluntary ride sharing is an answer and the tech people like to suggest home offices.  I support all of those as we all should.  But in the end, it does take lots and lots and lots of funding and those will fall short.  Should we try them, sure go ahead&#8230;let&#8217;s educate, encourage and work together.  But let&#8217;s be honest and admit that if we want to address the Treasure Valley transit congestion it will take massive amounts of funding from public sources and that means taxes.  Again, whether you want to support public transit or not, massive funding will be required to add lanes, rebuild interchanges, condemn right of way and otherwise maintain our current plans.</p>
<p>So, now we are left with question of who is going to pay these taxes?  My vote is for the feds and tourists.  I am also somewhat skeptical that will generate enough, so just as others who have published the studies (so many times) have concluded maybe the solution rests with US.  Maybe a local funding source should be identified and tapped to solve these local problems.  Maybe, as Pogo said, we have found the problem and it is US and maybe it is up to US to solve it&#8230;not the feds, not the state but the true beneficiaries of the good that will come of it.  So with that in mind, and as I have stated previously, our first step must be identifying a secure and long term source of funding.  My recommendation is we support the proposal that will be made to the Idaho legislature that would allow a local vote to fund transportation improvements&#8230;both roads/highways and transit.  The proposal would require a super majority and would have many sideboards and protections for taxpayers and voters.  The public vote would include a requirement that the plan for spending any funds be detailed and publicized completely.  The actual language of the legislative proposal is located at various places including <a href="http://www.valleyregionaltransit.org/Portals/0/CoalitionForPT/DraftRTAlegislation.pdf." rel="nofollow"></a><a href="http://www.valleyregionaltransit.org/Portals/0/CoalitionForPT/DraftRTAlegislation.pdf" rel="nofollow ugc">http://www.valleyregionaltransit.org/Portals/0/CoalitionForPT/DraftRTAlegislation.pdf</a>.</p>
<p>Oh, and in reply to Billy Idaho and Mr. Logic, do you really think it would be a wise career move for me to criticize Company execs?  As far as Simplot is concerned, I am very proud of some of our programs including subsidized van pooling, flexible work hours for avoiding traffic congestion, our sustainable Simplot award program which recognizes successful reductions in energy usage and many other corporate wide programs to address these issues. Are we doing enough&#8230;no&#8230;none of us are and now we all must do more&#8230;including paying more taxes.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Boise No Pants Day		</title>
		<link>https://boiseguardian.com/2008/01/16/all-aboard-guardian-transit-line/#comment-7396</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Boise No Pants Day]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Jan 2008 07:04:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://boiseguardian.com/wp/?p=849#comment-7396</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Response to the proposition of &quot;Boise&#039;s 1st Annual No Pants Day&quot; to &quot;generate awareness for the Treasure Valley&#039;s need for intelligent transportation solutions&quot; has been overwhelming and positive.

The date has been changed to the First Friday in May, to coincide with similar events elsewhere.

Boise&#039;s 1st Annual No Pants Day will be Friday, May 2nd, 2008.

Visit  www.boisenopantsday.com  for more info


]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Response to the proposition of &#8220;Boise&#8217;s 1st Annual No Pants Day&#8221; to &#8220;generate awareness for the Treasure Valley&#8217;s need for intelligent transportation solutions&#8221; has been overwhelming and positive.</p>
<p>The date has been changed to the First Friday in May, to coincide with similar events elsewhere.</p>
<p>Boise&#8217;s 1st Annual No Pants Day will be Friday, May 2nd, 2008.</p>
<p>Visit  <a href="http://www.boisenopantsday.com" rel="nofollow ugc">http://www.boisenopantsday.com</a>  for more info</p>
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		<title>
		By: Curious Bob		</title>
		<link>https://boiseguardian.com/2008/01/16/all-aboard-guardian-transit-line/#comment-7395</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Curious Bob]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Jan 2008 02:58:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://boiseguardian.com/wp/?p=849#comment-7395</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Wow Guardian, is this a record number of comments?

Obviously transit is a very complicated subject, and its hard to figure out a workable, fair solution to the issues.

Just wanted to mention that I believe Valley Ride or Valley Regional Transit does have a 6 year plan. They call it &quot;Treasure Valley in Transit.&quot; According to the Valley Regional Transit website this will cost about $44.5 million a year to implement. It is unclear to me if this figure is for their total budget or for the additional cost of service, but in any case they seem to have a plan ready to go. Is the best way to improve the bus system to give it additional funding? More routes, frequency of service, and extended hours of operation all cost something right?

Also, do we know exactly what kind of projects will be proposed if the legislature approves an optional tax?
]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow Guardian, is this a record number of comments?</p>
<p>Obviously transit is a very complicated subject, and its hard to figure out a workable, fair solution to the issues.</p>
<p>Just wanted to mention that I believe Valley Ride or Valley Regional Transit does have a 6 year plan. They call it &#8220;Treasure Valley in Transit.&#8221; According to the Valley Regional Transit website this will cost about $44.5 million a year to implement. It is unclear to me if this figure is for their total budget or for the additional cost of service, but in any case they seem to have a plan ready to go. Is the best way to improve the bus system to give it additional funding? More routes, frequency of service, and extended hours of operation all cost something right?</p>
<p>Also, do we know exactly what kind of projects will be proposed if the legislature approves an optional tax?</p>
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		By: Meridian Mike		</title>
		<link>https://boiseguardian.com/2008/01/16/all-aboard-guardian-transit-line/#comment-7394</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Meridian Mike]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Jan 2008 02:39:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://boiseguardian.com/wp/?p=849#comment-7394</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Great discussion everyone, and thank you, Guardian for getting it rolling.
For those of us who are too tied to our jobs in the middle of the day to accept your gracious City Club invitation, Tom, can you convince Kelli Fairless to possibly weigh in on this discussion?  Or maybe like the rest of us, she&#039;s managed to find this site.

If so, my  first question, Kelli, is:  Is Valleyride.org a non profit and, as such, is it free to pursue donations directly from individuals and companies?  I&#039;m thinking about a wildly successful Idaho non profit, Channel 4 public television....a non profit that, by producing a good product, has a large community base (unencumbered by political boundaries) and with it a stable (non tax!)  revenue source.  While the city of Meridian is certainly under car commuter political pressure to spend tax revenue wisely,  I&#039;m free to personally blow my money on anything I like, and nothing would mean more to me than having useful bus routes. .

What constraints does Valley Ride have on developing a trial route?  For example, what  if a group of donors said, ”Here&#039;s enough money to meet the variable expenses of running a bus for a three (or six or twelve) month trial,  will you use one of your extra buses to start a public route along this major artery or an express bus to this location?”  How much per mile would that be?  Does Valley Ride get all the ride share information it needs from ACHD and if not, and at the risk of offending ACHD, isn&#039;t that data integral to what Valley Ride is trying to accomplish?   I have a lot more questions and I&#039;ll bet other bloggers might as well, Kelli, but that would sure help for starters.   Rather than sending our comments and questions to committees (ah, government), I know I&#039;d much prefer an answer in this forum, so we can can all learn from it.  Thank you very much and good luck improving the bus system.
]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great discussion everyone, and thank you, Guardian for getting it rolling.<br />
For those of us who are too tied to our jobs in the middle of the day to accept your gracious City Club invitation, Tom, can you convince Kelli Fairless to possibly weigh in on this discussion?  Or maybe like the rest of us, she&#8217;s managed to find this site.</p>
<p>If so, my  first question, Kelli, is:  Is Valleyride.org a non profit and, as such, is it free to pursue donations directly from individuals and companies?  I&#8217;m thinking about a wildly successful Idaho non profit, Channel 4 public television&#8230;.a non profit that, by producing a good product, has a large community base (unencumbered by political boundaries) and with it a stable (non tax!)  revenue source.  While the city of Meridian is certainly under car commuter political pressure to spend tax revenue wisely,  I&#8217;m free to personally blow my money on anything I like, and nothing would mean more to me than having useful bus routes. .</p>
<p>What constraints does Valley Ride have on developing a trial route?  For example, what  if a group of donors said, ”Here&#8217;s enough money to meet the variable expenses of running a bus for a three (or six or twelve) month trial,  will you use one of your extra buses to start a public route along this major artery or an express bus to this location?”  How much per mile would that be?  Does Valley Ride get all the ride share information it needs from ACHD and if not, and at the risk of offending ACHD, isn&#8217;t that data integral to what Valley Ride is trying to accomplish?   I have a lot more questions and I&#8217;ll bet other bloggers might as well, Kelli, but that would sure help for starters.   Rather than sending our comments and questions to committees (ah, government), I know I&#8217;d much prefer an answer in this forum, so we can can all learn from it.  Thank you very much and good luck improving the bus system.</p>
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		<title>
		By: sara		</title>
		<link>https://boiseguardian.com/2008/01/16/all-aboard-guardian-transit-line/#comment-7393</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[sara]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jan 2008 19:53:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://boiseguardian.com/wp/?p=849#comment-7393</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Tom Ryder, apology accepted.

However, in regards to your premise that all options must be on the table, I disagree.

Why spend countless more years and a lot more money on studying all options, when it is more than likely that some of those options will never come to fruition?  It sounds like ITD studying widening the interstate to 3 lanes over a period of three years when four lanes were needed 3 years ago and the price during the interim skyrocketed.

At some point we need to say enough to studies and start doing.  Our bus system today is rather pathetic and not well used.  This discussion re the bus system has been the same for the last 20 years.  It is time for action.

The bus system is the only viable transit option for this valley.  Even those who want the train on the existing tracks that goes basically nowhere is going to need a bus system that links up with it.

So rather than spend a lot of time blathering on and on about options, there should be an effort undertaken immediately to design a bus system that can work. Then figure out the costs of expanding the system and then figure out the revenue stream.

If the solons in this community decide to power through a sales tax increase (assuming the Leg authorizes it) without a doable plan in place, I doubt it will pass and it should not.

Realistically, other than lack of will, there is nothing keeping Valley Ride from redesigning their system as we speak.
]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tom Ryder, apology accepted.</p>
<p>However, in regards to your premise that all options must be on the table, I disagree.</p>
<p>Why spend countless more years and a lot more money on studying all options, when it is more than likely that some of those options will never come to fruition?  It sounds like ITD studying widening the interstate to 3 lanes over a period of three years when four lanes were needed 3 years ago and the price during the interim skyrocketed.</p>
<p>At some point we need to say enough to studies and start doing.  Our bus system today is rather pathetic and not well used.  This discussion re the bus system has been the same for the last 20 years.  It is time for action.</p>
<p>The bus system is the only viable transit option for this valley.  Even those who want the train on the existing tracks that goes basically nowhere is going to need a bus system that links up with it.</p>
<p>So rather than spend a lot of time blathering on and on about options, there should be an effort undertaken immediately to design a bus system that can work. Then figure out the costs of expanding the system and then figure out the revenue stream.</p>
<p>If the solons in this community decide to power through a sales tax increase (assuming the Leg authorizes it) without a doable plan in place, I doubt it will pass and it should not.</p>
<p>Realistically, other than lack of will, there is nothing keeping Valley Ride from redesigning their system as we speak.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Mr. Logic		</title>
		<link>https://boiseguardian.com/2008/01/16/all-aboard-guardian-transit-line/#comment-7392</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mr. Logic]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jan 2008 19:15:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://boiseguardian.com/wp/?p=849#comment-7392</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Probably a little tacky to pile on Mr. Ryder along with Billy, but here goes anyway.  My neighbor works for Simplot and gets a big gas guzzler at company expense.  Apparently they encourage the brass by providing expensive cars as a perk.  Seems like society would be better off if they got a hot pink van like the G-man advocates.

Mr. Ryder, are you a RIDER or do you get one of those expensive company cars?  I hope you can tell the City Club you ride the bus.
Given the number of &quot;company cars&quot; and pick ups, perhaps your efforts at reducing automobile use should start at the office.
]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Probably a little tacky to pile on Mr. Ryder along with Billy, but here goes anyway.  My neighbor works for Simplot and gets a big gas guzzler at company expense.  Apparently they encourage the brass by providing expensive cars as a perk.  Seems like society would be better off if they got a hot pink van like the G-man advocates.</p>
<p>Mr. Ryder, are you a RIDER or do you get one of those expensive company cars?  I hope you can tell the City Club you ride the bus.<br />
Given the number of &#8220;company cars&#8221; and pick ups, perhaps your efforts at reducing automobile use should start at the office.</p>
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		By: Billy Idaho		</title>
		<link>https://boiseguardian.com/2008/01/16/all-aboard-guardian-transit-line/#comment-7391</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Billy Idaho]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jan 2008 17:22:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://boiseguardian.com/wp/?p=849#comment-7391</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Mr. Ryder,
I am interested in why the Simplot Company is so interested in supporting the mass transit issue other than just being a good corporate citizen?

What is the Simplot Company doing now to reduce traffic and air pollution?  I looked on the company website under employee benefits and expected to see some info about how dedicated Simplot Company is toward the cause such as carpooling information.

]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mr. Ryder,<br />
I am interested in why the Simplot Company is so interested in supporting the mass transit issue other than just being a good corporate citizen?</p>
<p>What is the Simplot Company doing now to reduce traffic and air pollution?  I looked on the company website under employee benefits and expected to see some info about how dedicated Simplot Company is toward the cause such as carpooling information.</p>
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		<title>
		By: TJ		</title>
		<link>https://boiseguardian.com/2008/01/16/all-aboard-guardian-transit-line/#comment-7390</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[TJ]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jan 2008 15:40:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://boiseguardian.com/wp/?p=849#comment-7390</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[As a native of this valley, I would like to report that I have never been on the freeway except to exit the state for a vacation somewhere else. I totally agree with dh and have no sympathy for the freeway drivers. They knew what their commute would be before they ever purchased a home in Kuna or Nampa.  My suggestion would be to move closer to your job or get a job closer to your home. Stay out of commuter traffic - it&#039;s a killer.


]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As a native of this valley, I would like to report that I have never been on the freeway except to exit the state for a vacation somewhere else. I totally agree with dh and have no sympathy for the freeway drivers. They knew what their commute would be before they ever purchased a home in Kuna or Nampa.  My suggestion would be to move closer to your job or get a job closer to your home. Stay out of commuter traffic &#8211; it&#8217;s a killer.</p>
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		By: dh		</title>
		<link>https://boiseguardian.com/2008/01/16/all-aboard-guardian-transit-line/#comment-7389</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[dh]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Jan 2008 01:55:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://boiseguardian.com/wp/?p=849#comment-7389</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In the wild Mother Nature handles infestations of lemmings with cliffs and takes out overpopulations of jack rabbits with epidemics like Tularemia or increases in the numbers of ravenous coyotes and hawks.

Although I feel sympathy for the Idahoans caught up in the local traffic messes I enjoy the Hell out of the daily traffic cam reviews of all the two legged immigrant lemmings nose to tail in grid lock sucking up their peer&#039;s carcinogenic exhaust at the source of its creation.

As far as voluntarily spending one more dime of my money so the transplants can still afford their mcmansions in Nampa, Murphy, Middleton, Eagle (WHATEVER) and commute comfortably to Boise?  NO!  That money too will have to continue to be extorted from me.

]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In the wild Mother Nature handles infestations of lemmings with cliffs and takes out overpopulations of jack rabbits with epidemics like Tularemia or increases in the numbers of ravenous coyotes and hawks.</p>
<p>Although I feel sympathy for the Idahoans caught up in the local traffic messes I enjoy the Hell out of the daily traffic cam reviews of all the two legged immigrant lemmings nose to tail in grid lock sucking up their peer&#8217;s carcinogenic exhaust at the source of its creation.</p>
<p>As far as voluntarily spending one more dime of my money so the transplants can still afford their mcmansions in Nampa, Murphy, Middleton, Eagle (WHATEVER) and commute comfortably to Boise?  NO!  That money too will have to continue to be extorted from me.</p>
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